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Without the freedom to make critical remarks, there cannot exist sincere
flattering praise
- Beaumarchais.


What is a pineapple knot ? 
                     What is a herringbone knot ?  
                                                   What is a herringbone pineapple knot ?


How to make
STANDARD HERRINGBONE KNOTS
while understanding their structure and not simply being a mimicker.

This document should be read by those whose intent is to use my HER3 program for the HP48GX emulator as they will have a better grasp of those knots and so will be more at ease when making use of the HER3 program.

As the document with its 33 pages is rather lengthy  it is a summary of what is 
exposed in several hundreds of pages by SCHAAKE & TURNER )  I decided that it would be better to put it in as a downloadable PDF file.   (over 3.2 Mo so careful
with dial-up connection)

Reading it,  provided you are only interested, 
you will understand, among others
points, 
why NO ONE -except Schaake - ever dare to publish REAL STANDARD
HERRINGBONE KNOT of more than 2-PASS.
At least the rather extensive search I did has not found it.

A special illustration for those who find "hard to understand" the SEQUENCE
RULE.

Writing this document made me realize that may be I should :
1/ write in this form the page on the THK algorithm
2/ say that the many documentations written for the HP48GX programs that I wrote for my page Publication_3 could be pretty eyes opening even for people having no intention of  using those programs as they attempt to explain how the knots are made "calculable". For  example about Herringbone-PINEAPPLE see NESTED BIGHT KNOTS ALGORITHM
MADE EASIER
 and also  ST_HERRING_PINEAPPLE
My suggestion is that before reading the document you read those.

SHORT NOTES ON THE SO-CALLED HERRINGBONE PATTERN 

In architecture the PSEUDO FISHBONE pattern (“arÍte de poisson”, the so-called
herringbone of the English speaking world) should be Opus piscatum  alas this does not exist 

except as elucubration on the  Net but Classical Architectural Texts and Treatises ONLY KNOW mention  opus spicatum as a well known feature. 

PISCA = FISH           SPICA = WHEAT EAR

Please have a look at those architectural details
http://www.lunas.org/histoire_de_lunas/histoire_ndnize2
http://www.montjoye.net/Ivry_la_bataille_chateau

Why the English world chose herringbone rather than mackerel or sardine bones is still a mystery to me. 
We French, much more open in our options, just say ‘fishbone’ or ‘arÍte de poisson’
any fish will do, not limiting ourselves to herring ! 
May be that has to do with our very different cooking style !

The fishbone PATTERN (OK herringbone, it is)  can have no less than four 
orientations. 

This fishbone pattern is common to :
--- so called STANDARD HERRINGBONE knots,
--- knots with a herringbone PATTERN whether they ARE PINEAPPLE or they ARE
NOT
 PINEAPPLE. 

The above cited knots are INTER-BIGHT-RIM coded (row code” for horizontal mandrel, column coded for  vertical  cylinder ) , but another type of knot the so-called GAUCHO knots which are PARALLEL-BIGHT coded (column coded for mandrel, row coded for  cylinder) can be considered to offer a herringbone pattern.

For the INTER-BIGHT coded  the tail of the fish  is on one BIGHT-RIM and the head is on the other. 

For the PARALLEL-BIGHT coded the fish is eating its own tail.
 

The nested 'V' series that form the PATTERN can be made by nested-bight as in the 
HERRINGBONE PINEAPPLE or, it can be made in the  total absence of nested bight as in STANDARD HERRINGBONE knots, other INTER-BIGHT coded knots with a fishbone PATTERN, or the GAUCHO. 

Using the PATTERN only (that is the final fixed state of a process of coding the knot) without taking on account the process itself (process being a temporary state that disappear once the final fixed state is attained) is always a silly way to go as that is equivalent to be doing very bad phenetics which is rather to be avoided as far as well thought nomenclature is concerned. 

ASHLEY shown some knots with the so-called herringbone pattern.

#1290. Herringbone weave Which is  multi-strand  and INTER-BIGHT coded. 

#1291. Herringboning, parallel with the length of the knot which is PARALLEL-BIGHT coded. 

#1292 Herringbone weave by another method which is multi strand and PARALLEL-bight coded 

#1300         #1301         #1302 

#1589 A Herringbone shroud knot which is PARALLEL-BIGHT CODED. 

Bruce GRANT (who left this world in 1977 ) wrote in ENCYCLOPEDIA of 
RAWHIDE AND LEATHER BRAIDING
(a must have book even if the drawings are not always that easy to follow) writing at a time when there was no real interest in the 
knot-tying world about correctly thought about nomenclature (not that nowadays there is 
much of that if believe the ‘sottises' without number I saw , pardon I still see written or 
illustrated by photo with mistaken label of the knot shown in forum posts and web pages ! )


* 414-415-416-417 (even 418 419 ) HERRINGBONE knots. 
They are with a herringbone pattern , inter-bight coded multi-strand except so-called 
BRUCE's and CATHARINE's that are single strand.
In pages 420 and following he makes clear distinction and label pineapple or gaucho knot (only now the gaucho has another connotation for us : a pattern rather than a name) one with NESTED BIGHTS. 

GRANT clearly states : “Where the herringbone knot ( Plate 171 – page 415) was an
interweave of two turk’s-head of the same number of part and bight, the pineapple knot is an interweave of two turk’s-head of the same number of bights but different number of parts

Very well observed that  is sure; wish that the multitude that is naming a Pineapple a 
Herringbone or vice versa could put that painfully simple words in their brain for keeps !
(well SCHAAKE & TURNER are an awful lot more rigorous. It seems to me that 
SCHAAKE had respect for GRANT’s work.)

GRANT also shows (pages 424 and after ) the FLORES BUTTON knot, a single strand knot which has a herringbone pattern INTER-BIGHT coded. 

He also shows (p 426, 427,) a single strand PARALLEL-BIGHT coded herringbone 
patterned knot : the small FAN KNOT ( see also p 430 – 431 ) 

Pages 432-432 Grant shows THE PERFECT PINEAPPLE a single strand knot with a 
herringbone pattern , INTER-BIGHT coded with NO NESTED BIGHT. NOT having any nested-bight it cannot be a Pineapple perfect or not and it is not a HERRINGBONE knot either as it has none of the characteristic bight rim, but it is  simply a knot with a herringbone pattern. 

The HER3 RPL program I wrote for the HP48GX can only treat the coding of each 
half-period of STANDARD HERRINGBONE KNOTS. (see Publications_3 in my web pages).
This program does that by strictly following the algorithm described in BRAIDING 
STANDARD HERRINGBONE KNOTS
( Schaake & Turner) 

Too many persons – some having authored acclaimed books – make egregious mistakes about:  
- STANDARD HERRINGBONE KNOTS (SHK)
- STANDARD HERRINGBONE PINEAPPLE KNOTS (SHPAK)
- KNOTS WITH A HERRINGBONE PATTERN but are not SHK or SHPAK

Egregious mistakes resulting in those persons making an unpalatable mixed salad with those knots and propagating false notions to the unaware or the unable to think critically (in the best sense of the word : thinking autonomously ).

Just to exemplify : 

an acclaimed Australian Braider, the late RON EDWARDS ( left this world recently) in his
Advanced Leatherwork –Volume 2
made those:
( make no mistake I like Ron EDWARDS books with all their faults  and one must have them in a serious collection of books, just as Tom HALL ( HICKEY) books are to be added to such a collection even if HALL is far from  being at EDAWARDS' level .
Just use them with a 'critical mind' , in other words a mind that is quite open though 
maintaining a keen and intelligent vigilance. Never allow an entry visa to anything told to you unless you have personally  personally validated it using intelligent and deep thought rather than blind admiration or following "the alleged reputation be it good or bad". THINK AUTONOMOUSLY)

*1** Page 62 PINEAPPLE KNOT R.E says. Certainly NOT ! 
NO nested-bight. Can not be a PINEAPPLE.
It is NOT a STANDARD HERRINGBONE knot either but ONLY a knot that is an 
interweave of two identical THK with a herringbone PATTERN. 
Cannot be treated by HER3 

*2** Page 63 PINEAPPLE KNOT R.E says. Certainly NOT ! 
It is not a STANDARD HERRINGBONE knot either but ONLY a knot that is an
interweave of two identical THK with a herringbone PATTERN. 
Cannot be treated by HER3 

*3** Pages 74-75 PINEAPPLE KNOT R.E says . Certainly NOT ! 
NO nested-bight. 
Can not be a PINEAPPLE 
It is a Standard Herringbone knot, HER3 compliant, but the book has a mistake in the HP1 that ends with U1 and NOT U2, still the diagram itself is correct 

*4** Pages 76-77 PINEAPPLE KNOT R.E says. Certainly NOT !
NO nested-bight. Can not be a PINEAPPLE.
It is not a STANDARD HERRINGBONE knot either but ONLY a knot that is an 
interweave of two identical THK with a herringbone PATTERN. 
Cannot be treated by HER3

*5** Pages 160-161 PINEAPPLE KNOT R.E says.  Certainly NOT !
NO nested-bight. Can not be a PINEAPPLE.
It is not a STANDARD HERRINGBONE knot either but ONLY a knot that is an 
interweave of two identical THK with a herringbone PATTERN. 
Cannot be treated by HER3 

*6** Pages 162-163 PINEAPPLE KNOT R.E says. Certainly NOT !
NO nested-bight. Can not be a PINEAPPLE 
It is a Standard Herringbone knot, HER3 compliant, but the book has a mistake in the HP1 that ends with U1 and NOT U2, still the diagram itself is correct 

*7** Pages 164-165 PINEAPPLE KNOT R.E says. Certainly NOT !
NO nested-bight. Can not be a PINEAPPLE.
SINGLE STRAND knot with HERRINGBONE pattern.

*8** Pages 172-173. PINEAPPLE KNOT R.E says. Certainly NOT ! 
NO nested-bight. Cannot be a PINEAPPLE 

SINGLE STRAND HERRINGBONE pattern “HERRINGBONE KNOT” of Page132-
133 / Page136-137 / Page138-139 / Page142-143 / Page152-153 

As they are SINGLE STRAND KNOT they are not HER3 compliant. 

PLEASE DON’T MISUNDERSTAND THE ABOVE : this book by EDWARDS is just useless as far as seriously considered nomenclature goes but it will be a considerable help to people
who want to make knots without thinking to much.

To steal some observation from a friend : 
it will be - just as Hall's- a considerable help to those who don’t want to “learn” but just “mimic” without in-depth information being acquired.

If such a man of craft as Ron EDWARDS indeed was  could be so egregiously mistaken just imagine what silliness one can encounters on the Net.

This I wrote to help those who want to think critically and learn, provided they are pointed in a better direction (I cannot think of any better than Schaake & Turner ) about those knots ; the other sort of person happily do without me just as I happily do without them. 

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MY PLAYING WITH  FISHBONE PATTERNS : CROSSED PATTERNS
multi and single strands.
FOUR GRIDS.

  

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Copyright 2005 Sept - Charles Hamel / Nautile -
Overall rewriting in August 2006 . Copyright renewed. 2007-2014 -(each year of existence)

Url : http://charles.hamel.free.fr/knots-and-cordages/